This Week With George Stephanopoulos   View more episodes

Aired at 08:00 AM on Sunday, Dec 27, 2009 (12/27/2009)      View all transcripts from this day


00:00:00>>> And as always, the sunday funnies.
00:00:05>> Meteorologists are calling this a record blizzard.
00:00:09It makes sense.
00:00:11They always said that the senate would pass health care when hell freezes over.
00:00:14Apparently it has.
00:00:27>>> Good morning.
00:00:28We're learning more about the 23-year-old nigerian man that government has charnld with trying to blow up that northwest airlines flight on christmas day.
00:00:46His name was on a list, but never made it on the no-fly list.
00:00:55Now air travelers will face stepped up security measures.
00:00:57Joining us from san francisco, janet napolitano.
00:00:58Thank for joining us.
00:00:58>> Good morning.
00:01:01>> I want to get your response to joe liker man saying -- I am troubled by so many aspects of this case.
00:01:13Include how the suspect escaped the attention of the state department.
00:01:20How the suspect managed to visa and why he was not recognizeded edd as someone on the terrorist database.
00:01:34How do you address these questions?
00:01:40>> I think first of all, we're investigating, as always.
00:01:45Going backwards to see what happened and when.
00:01:50Who knew what and when?
00:01:51I think it's important for the public to understand that there are different types of databases.
00:01:53There was never information in place that would put this individual on a no-fly list.
00:01:59Or on a selectee list.
00:02:01I think the important thing to recognize here is that once this incident occurred, everything happened that should have.
00:02:04The passengers reacted correctly, the crew reacted correctly.
00:02:07Within an hour to 90 minutes, all 128 flights in the air were notified.
00:02:15They took mitigation measures on the off chance that somebody else was traveling with other kinds of detrukt ifr intent.
00:02:29The system worked very, very smoothly over the last couple of days.
00:02:35>> Let me ask you about intelligent sharing.
00:02:40The suspect's father embassy in nigeria and said, I'm worried, because my son is displayed extremist religious views, how was that information shared with other parts of the u.s.
00:02:46Government or did it stay just at that embassy?
00:02:51>> We're going to go back and really do a minute by minute, day by day scrub of that sort of thing.
00:03:00But, when he presented himself to fly, he was on a tide list.
00:03:10A tide list says his name had come up somewhere, somehow.
00:03:16The no-fly and selectee lists require specific derogatory information.
00:03:18That was not available throughout the law enforcement community.
00:03:23He went through screening in amsterdam.
00:03:28As he prepared to board a flight to the united states.
00:03:36The authorities in am tsterdam are working with us to make sure that was properly done.
00:03:45We have nothing to suggest it wasn't.
00:03:46Important for the traveling public to recognize, a, everybody reacted the way they should.
00:03:49We train for this, plan for this, exercise for this event should it occur.
00:03:56And b, we have added additional screening, what we call mitigation measures.
00:04:02They'll be continuing.
00:04:05For awhile.
00:04:07We ask people perhaps to show up a little bit earlier at the airport in the holiday season.
00:04:17And recognize that we're going to be doing different things at different airports.
00:04:24Don't think somebody at tsa is not on the job if you see people doing different things at different airports.
00:04:27>> You keep saying everybody acted the way they were supposed to.
00:04:29Clearly, the passengers and crew of that northwest airlines flight did.
00:04:35I think there are questions of whether everybody in the u.s.
00:04:40Government did.
00:04:40Here's a question.
00:04:42So many of us are subject to random security searches all the time, how come somebody not on a terrorist database is not under more stringent security?
00:04:50When they check into a flight to ?
00:04:52Why does that not automatically happen?
00:04:53>> If he had specific information that put him on the selectee list or the no-fly list.
00:05:00He would not have gotten on a plane.
00:05:04Those numbers pyramid down.
00:05:05They need to.
00:05:09Again, there's lots of information that flies about this world on a lot of different people.
00:05:14What we have to do in law enforcement is, not only collect and share, but do it in the proper way.
00:05:21Now, once this incident occurred, everything went according to clock work.
00:05:26Not only sharing throughout the air industry, but sharing with the state and local law enforcement agencies.
00:05:36Products were going out on christmas day.
00:05:42They went out yesterday.
00:05:45Through the industry, to make sure that the traveling public remains safe.
00:05:53I would leave you with that message.
00:05:56The traveling public is safe.
00:05:56We have additional measures in light of this situation.
00:06:00Everyone reacted like they should.
00:06:03Once the incident occurred, the system worked.
00:06:04>> What can you tell us about the suspect?
00:06:06Has a definitive connection with al qaeda been made?
00:06:07>> That's the subject of investigation.
00:06:10It would be inappropriate to say or to speculate.
00:06:16We'll let the fbi and the criminal justice system do their work.
00:06:19>> One final question for you.
00:06:22An october report from the government accountability office says that almost $800 million has been spent on new technologies but since tsa's creation, ten technologies have been in various stages of research, development, procurement, and deployment, but tsa has not deployed any of them to airports nationwide.
00:06:59Why have the technologies not been sent to airports nationwide?
00:07:01>> Without going into the accuracy or inaccuracy of that particular report, new technology has been deployed.
00:07:10There's a more important important to be made.
00:07:13Which is that, "a," technology is evolving all the time.
00:07:19It's not a static situation.
00:07:24And "b," even with the most sophisticated technology, everybody needs to play part in their security.
00:07:30That's why I think the actions of the passengers and crew on the flight deserve praise.
00:07:32That's why the men and women working really overtime, christmas day, yesterday, whatever, to make sure that all other flights remain safe, why that system is so important.
00:07:46You can't rely on just one part of the security system.
00:07:49You have to look at the system as a whole.
00:07:51>> Thanks so much for joining us.
00:07:52>> Thank you.
00:07:53>>> Now we'll turn to the president's chief spokesman, and close adviser, robert gibbs.
00:08:00Merry christmas, thanks for joining us.
00:08:01>> Happy holidays, jake.
00:08:04>> A terrorist attack almost happened, had it not been for a faulty detonator.
00:08:13Are you confident that the obama administration is doing everything it needs to do, and did so in this instance, to keep the american people safe?
00:08:25>> Absolutely.
00:08:26Let's touch on a few things.
00:08:31The database that this individual was on contained about 550,000 names.
00:08:40A smaller database of about 400,000 of those names are what selectee and no-fly lists are drawn from.
00:08:46The selectee list has about 13,000.
00:08:48The no-fly list has about 4,000.
00:08:50It's whittled down into much smaller no-fly and selectee lists.
00:08:52The president has asked for two look back reviews.
00:08:57First on our watch-listing pr procedures.
00:09:04Did the government do everything it could have with the npsz nafgs that they had?
00:09:18Understanding that the procedures are several years old.
00:09:19Did we do what we needed to with that information?
00:09:21How can we revise systems going forward to make sure that no information is clogged somewhere and is going to the highest levels of security.
00:09:26Obviously, we have to review our detection capabilities.
00:09:29The president has asked the department of homeland security to answer the very real question about how somebody with something as dangerous at petn could have gotten on a plane in amsterdam.
00:09:44I think those are the two reviews to come directly out of this.
00:09:52The president is confident that this government is doing what it can to seek out those that intend to do us harm.
00:10:05We're drawing down in iraq.
00:10:09We're focusing on the places in the world where attacks have previously been planned.
00:10:14Where that planning goes on now.
00:10:17We've strengthened our partnerships and cooperation with a number of countries including yemen, pakistan, somalia.
00:10:24And used all elements of our american power to seek to eliminate heads of al qaeda power.
00:10:37>> Knowing the president, I've been covering him for a few years, I can't imagine that he would hear this guy's father reported to the embassy that he had extremist views, within a matter of weeks, he boards an airplane with explosives on his person.
00:10:57I can't believe that he would hear that information and say, that's nuts.
00:11:02Why did that happen?
00:11:03>> He's heard it and not long after it was brought to the situation room.
00:11:05That's what's precipitated a watch listing review and a detection capabilities review to ensure that one, the information that we have goes through process the right way and surfaces to those that have to make the decisions.
00:11:19Again we have a watch list that this individual is on.
00:11:24That contains about 550,000 names.
00:11:28So this individual was listed in november of 2009 on that database based on that information.
00:11:34The no-fly list and the selectee lists -- >> but who was watching him if he's on that list?
00:11:50>> I think if you read the papers this morning, you'll find that the name was listed, concern was brought, the ability to -- >> brought to who?
00:12:05Anybody can write name.
00:12:05>> This is a database that a series of agencies enter names into and draw information from.
00:12:07Again, jake, the investigation will look backwards to see if signs were missed.
00:12:11There are 18,000 people on either a selectee or a no-fly list.
00:12:13This database contains 550,000 of those names.
00:12:16It's a huge number.
00:12:18We have to ensure, the president has asked that a review be undertaken swiftly to ensure that any information gathered and put into any database that it gets to where it needs to go to people that are making decisions.
00:12:33But understanding that 550,000 people are on that one database.
00:12:37The president wants to review some of the older procedures and see if they need to be updated.
00:12:45>> I want to get to health care reform.
00:12:50With the limited time we have left.
00:12:52There was deal making that went on as the legislation hit the house and the senate.
00:12:57That kind of deal making is one of the reasons that president obama, then senator obama pledged this on the campaign trail.
00:13:08>> We'll have the negotiations televised on c-span so people can see who is making arguments on behalf of their constituents and who is making arguments on behalf of the insurance companies and the drug companies.
00:13:28>> Politifact labeled that a breken promise.
00:13:33I'm feeling more generous.
00:13:36You have one more step in the negotiation process.
00:13:40The president said this on pbs.
00:13:41>> We hope to have a whole bunch of folks over here in the west wing and I'll be rolling up my sleeves and spending time before the full congress gets into session because the american people need it now.
00:13:50>> With that in mind, will the president open up the doors for the final negotiation?
00:13:54He's in charge of it.
00:13:56It will be at the west wing.
00:14:02Democratic leaders of the house and senate.
00:14:08Will he commit to opening up that process to the c-span cameras?
00:14:23>> That process has played out over the course of nine months.
00:14:30There have been countless numbers of public hearings.
00:14:32The senate did a lot of voting 00 in the morning on c-span.
00:14:33The president pledged to see who was fighting for whom.
00:14:35>> He was talking about negotiations not voting.
00:14:37>> I think the floor of the senate is where the bill got augmented.
00:14:42If you watched that debate.
00:14:4600 in the morning for a lot of the votes.
00:14:53You have seen quite a bit of public hearing and public airing.
00:14:58I think people have a good sense of who is battling on behalf of thousands of lobbyists trying to protect drug and insurance profits and who is fighting for middle class americans and removing insurance company restrictions like discriminating against people that are sick.
00:15:22>> All right, robert gibbs, we'll have to leave it there.
00:15:24Thanks for joining us.
00:15:24Good luck.
00:15:25>> To you, your family, and your viewers, happy new year.
00:15:26>> Thank you.
00:15:26>>> Joining us from kentucky, SENATOR mitch McConnell.
00:15:29Thanks for joining us.
00:15:31>> Good morning, jake.
00:15:35>> Turning back to the attempted terror attack, the obama administration was following procedures published by the bush administration in the creation of the tsa, are they doing enough?
00:15:48Does more need to be done?
00:15:49>> Our leader on this issue, senator collins of maine, suggested to me yesterday, when we were talking about this, a question she's going to be asking which is, how does a person on the terrorism watch list get a u.s. visa?
00:16:05Particularly when you consider that his father was concerned about his son's proclivities this fall?
00:16:13I think there's much to investigate.
00:16:20In adishes addition to that, he had connections with yemen.
00:16:27We know -- and imam in yemen who may have been the inspiration to the ft. hood attack.
00:16:33There's much to investigate here.
00:16:35It's amazing a person sending out so many signals could get on a plane heading to the u.s.
00:16:42>> Do you think that the individuals, do you think they should automatically be at t very least subjected to additional security searches at airports?
00:16:51>> It only makes common sense.
00:16:54>> Turning to health care reform, another big issue on the plate of the administration and your plate as well.
00:17:01You've been criticized by several conservative voices, rush lib limb baug, eric ericson, you said, this fight is not over.
00:17:26My colleagues and I will work to stop this bill from becoming law.
00:17:33What are you going to do and what can you do with 40 votes?
00:17:35>> First, every republican opposed the measure.
00:17:37All the procedural devices to slow down a measure were employed.
00:17:39It didn't pass until christmas eve at 7:00 a.m.
00:17:40The american people are overwhelmingly opposed to the bill.
00:17:48The bill is not law yet.
00:17:52It's got to be reconciled between the house and senate.
00:18:02Every democrat in the senate provided the one vote that passed this 2,700-page monstrosity.
00:18:05It cuts medicare, raises taxes, and instead of curbing the rate of increase of insurance premiums, most americans insurance premiums will go up.
00:18:15This bill is a colossal failure.
00:18:20The american people were literally screaming at us, please, don't pass this bill.
00:18:22>> You criticize this bill for cutting medicare.
00:18:24There are cuts.
00:18:27Doctors' fees are cut.
00:18:3421% Next year.
00:18:35You have a history of voting for medicare cuts as well.
00:18:38You voted in 1995 to cut it by $270 billion.
00:18:451996 Budget resolution, you voted to cut it $158 million.
00:18:501997, The balanced budget act, you voted to slow its growth by $393 million.
00:18:53How do you square those votes from when senate republicans ran the senate, to you current criticism of the bill for cutting medicare?
00:19:06>> Easily.
00:19:06Those cuts were aimed at making medicare more stainable.
00:19:10What they're doing here is using it as a piggy bank.
00:19:18They're takeing a half trillion out of medicare and trying to spend the money on a new entitlement program for a different set of americans.
00:19:31We don't think you ought to take grandma's medicare and start a new program for someone else.
00:19:36>> Do you think republicans running for senate in 2010 should run on a platform of vowing to repeal the health care reform bill, should it become law?
00:19:57And will that be one of your first items should you regain control of the senate, repealing what you call obama-care.
00:20:01>> You have seen what's happened already with congressman griffith switching parties.
00:20:07There are rumors there may be others.
00:20:17There is great unrest in the democratic party.
00:20:18The american people are opposed to this effort to have the government take over their health care.
00:20:22It will be a huge issue next year.
00:20:24You hear the democrats saying, let's not tackle any big issues.
00:20:27They're nervous about cap and trade, reregulation.
00:20:37The new administration, the new congress has squandered it goodwill with the american people.
00:20:40Leading to what could be a big setback for them.
00:20:41>> Respectfully, you didn't answer my question.
00:20:44Should republicans campaign on a platform of repealing the health care reform measure?
00:20:54Will that be on your agenda should you become the leader of the majority?
00:20:57>> I'm sorry.
00:20:57I thought I answered it.
00:20:59There's no question that this bill will be a big, if not central, issue in the 2010 election but in the 2012 election.
00:21:12>> I'll take that as a yes.
00:21:16That they should campaign on repealing obama-care.
00:21:22You cut a deal with harry reid to secure a vote on the debt limit issue.
00:21:24A stand-alone vote.
00:21:28Plus five republicans amendments.
00:21:33Why was that important to you?
00:21:34>> Look this administration has run up more debt in the first year than the previous one in four years.
00:21:40They passed a budget that will double the debt in five years.
00:21:46They will triple the debt in ten years.
00:21:47Raising the debt ceiling is no longer an automatic.
00:21:49This is the nation's credit card.
00:21:50We think it's important to have a debate with amendments.
00:21:55About what we intend to try to accomplish for the american people to get this debt down.
00:22:00People are afraid their children will not have the country they had because of the debt.
00:22:04Raising the debt ceiling is a good time to have that debate.
00:22:11>> The congressional budget office says that the health care reform bill will reduce the deficit by $132 billion.
00:22:24But there's criticism from bruce bartlett who wrote -- it was a pure giveaway that had no dedicated financing, no offsets, no revenue raisers.
00:22:40100% Of the costs.
00:22:44As far as I'm concerned, any republican who voted for that has no right to criticize anything that the democrats have done.
00:22:55You voted for that drug benefit.
00:22:56It was not offset by revenue or spending cuts.
00:22:57>> Well, the first thing, you should notice is that it came in 30% underbudget because of the competitive mechanisms of extending a drug benefit to seniors.
00:23:06The democrats criticized it at the time, because it wasn't generous enough.
00:23:13And look.
00:23:16They have gone far beyond any deficit spending indiscretions that republicans might have had.
00:23:26In their first year alone, they ran the deficit up in one year more than the bush administration did in four years.
00:23:37Enough is enough.
00:23:37The american people are expecting us to stop this effort to spend, tax, and borrow us into oblivion.
00:23:41It's been going on for the last 12 months.
00:23:42>> All right, senator mitch McCONNELL, HAVE A GOOD HOLIDAY.
00:23:43Thanks for joining us.
00:23:44>> Same to you, jay.
00:23:49>>> "The roundtable" is next.
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00:29:35>>> The week before christmas, and all through the hill.
00:29:41Not a creature was stirring, not even a bill.
00:29:43>> People have voted, they mandated reform.
00:29:47But republicans blew off the gathering storm.
00:29:49>> How far away from common sense we'vread.
00:29:54>> Democrats exclaimed as they drove out of sight.
00:30:01Better coverage for all, even our friends on the right.
00:30:07>> Oh, the christmas stylings of senators bond and burris.
00:30:12Joining us now to talk about health care reform, which the poems were about, and other issues, david brooks, matt dowd, paul krugman and ruth marcus.
00:30:31We're going to start with the alarming christmas attack that almost happened.
00:30:33David, you heard secretary napolitano and robert gibbs give their answers.
00:30:35Pardon the pun, did their explanations fly with you?
00:30:40>> It didn't pass the laugh test with me.
00:30:41We all go through the airport.
00:30:45We all glo through the screening procedures.
00:30:49I and a lot of people have the feeling that that's jobs program, not a security program.
00:30:54It's all a joke.
00:30:58People can sneak stuff through.
00:31:00It was the passengers that did this.
00:31:06The guy was fitting every stereotype of the terrorist that you could imagine.
00:31:17He was a rich guy, went to fancy schools, a mechanic, he gets radicalized.
00:31:23A perfect bit of stereotyping would have caught this guy.
00:31:29>> Matt, when richard reid failed in his attempt to blow up a plane, president bush did not come out and say anything to the nation.
00:31:32President obama followed that playbook.
00:31:34Is that the right thing?
00:31:34>> Part of the problem is that things you think to be true in the beginning are not true as the days go on.
00:31:38Some of the things we first heard, we didn't catch.
00:31:44The real question is, it's, what are we spending the billions of dollars on?
00:31:50As david said, that are really doing the job?
00:31:52Is it a jobs program or a terrorist catching program?
00:31:57I think that's the question.
00:32:01>> I think there are two alarming things that happened here.
00:32:06First, this suspect's father authorities and said, you may have a problem here.
00:32:15He is not a u.s. citizen.
00:32:19He's a nigerian national.
00:32:20He's got a multiple entry visa into the united states.
00:32:22Why wasn't that yanked?
00:32:23Why wasn't he moved to the top of a real watch list, not the 550,000?
00:32:30I don't think this is the administration's fault.
00:32:31This is the way that bureaucracies work or don't work.
00:32:35Second, the screening processes, clearly, though we've spent billions and billions of dollars, there's simply not enough equipment to find the things that need to be found.
00:32:53>> I think we do want -- someone's head ought to roll.
00:32:54Every major military surprise that happened, there were ample warnings.
00:32:57The trouble is, there is so much information.
00:32:59There's 500,000 people on the list we're talking about.
00:33:03Stuff is going to fall through the cracks.
00:33:06You do what you can.
00:33:07But someone that is prepared to die while killing a bunch of civilians, it's going to happen now and then.
00:33:17We're using a lot of 20/20 hindsight.
00:33:21What was the kind of thing that always happens when anything goes wrong.
00:33:27>> To me, so the situation now is, what do we do in the aftermath of this?
00:33:30It looks like we usually profile an article of clothing, not the person.
00:33:35We're reluctant.
00:33:38It's from politically correctness to profile a person.
00:33:46The underwear is on fire on the plane, we might next have to profile underwear.
00:33:53>> Everyone now has to wear underwear on the outside.
00:33:55>> Tsa is talking about rules, international flights, for the last hour, no personal items in your lap.
00:33:59Can't get up for the last hour of international flights.
00:34:04This will affect us in the same way.
00:34:08But one of the other interesting things about this, ruth.
00:34:11This man, apparently, according to the information we have now.
00:34:13You pointed out, a lot of the early information is proven to be wrong.
00:34:19Apparently, he spent time in yemen.
00:34:24Was trained by al qaeda in the peninsula.
00:34:30Not necessarily a new front on the war on terror.
00:34:31This is coming up over and over.
00:34:32 yemen air strike on thursday morning.
00:34:33>> I think you could say there's a new front on terror.
00:34:38It's not particularly surprising.
00:34:40It doesn't mean that afghanistan and pakistan are not a concern.
00:34:45But it does underscore the new reality that -- terror is, that's sort of a floating crap game.
00:34:55You can move to it different locations.
00:34:57If you have a failed or failing state, as yemen is, as somalia is, those are breeding grounds and areas where al qaeda is flourishing.
00:35:13>> It's an ideological thing.
00:35:14Hi fit the profile.
00:35:15Rich, trapped between two worlds, the traditional world of his imagined past and the modern version.
00:35:21Just like the 9/11 guys, sort of like the ft. hood guy.
00:35:28They imagine some pure islamic ideology of the past that they're going to act out by killing people.
00:35:31It's the ideology that happens.
00:35:35It can happen anywhere.
00:35:36>> There are reports that he may have been radicalized in london, where he went to school.
00:35:42I want to turn now to another big issue.
00:35:46It's health care reform.
00:35:48It's been consuming a lot of your attention.
00:35:51Specifically, paul, you wrote a recent op ed saying, in favor of the senate health care reform.
00:35:55Three groups of those that oppose it.
00:36:00Your characterizations.
00:36:01One, the crazy right, two unhappy progressives and three, the bah humbug caucus of fiscal scolds.
00:36:08I don't want to point fingers.
00:36:13One of your fellow colleagues is opposing the health care reform measure.
00:36:16I am assuming you don't think david is part of the crazy right?
00:36:22>> Let's not jump to any conclusions.
00:36:24>> Let me say this.
00:36:27The objections is that they do not do enough to control costs.
00:36:33You have to ask, what more realistically could you expect?
00:36:38There was an article that said, they are in fact trying everything that people have suggested in the form of pilot programs.
00:36:48There's a whole list of things that we think might control costs.
00:36:52This will be in the legislation.
00:36:53It will be tried.
00:36:53This is the first serious attempt we have made to control health care costs.
00:36:56By doing that, it proved something to people like me, advocates of universal coverage.
00:37:02The only way to control costs is as part of a pack j that will also cover the uninsured.
00:37:13You have to go to people and say, this is is what we need to do to provide health security to everybody.
00:37:20This is is flawed, annoying, underfunded.
00:37:27I wish there was a public option.
00:37:29I wish for lots of things in there.
00:37:30But this is the most dramatic move to getting rational about health care spending.
00:37:35At the same time that it fills a good part of the holes in the safety net.
00:37:42Mr. brooks?
00:37:43>> I don't oppose it because i want to step on the necks of the poor.
00:37:50I oppose it, it's a close call for me.
00:37:51We used to spend 10% of our gnp on health care.
00:37:55Now it's 17%.
00:37:57Soon it will be 22%.
00:37:58More on health care.
00:38:00This bill will slightly increase the amount of money we spend on health care.
00:38:02What can you do to do something about that?
00:38:07I wouldn't mind a single pair.
00:38:10I prefer it to what we have tow.
00:38:12My preferred option is to give consumers choice.
00:38:14There are health economists.
00:38:15There was a bill.
00:38:19The widen-bennett bill.
00:38:21People said it's politically impossible.
00:38:22This bill, right now.
00:38:23In a poll, has 32% support.
00:38:28I think I could get 32% for a consumer related bill -- >> this is not about polling.
00:38:35A fair number of people that don't support it wanted something stronger.
00:38:40If you ask people about specific provisions -- the massachusetts program, this is a massachusetts type program for the united states.
00:38:55If you ask people in massachusetts, do you approve of it?
00:39:00People in massachusetts it's not favorable.
00:39:01If you ask people do you want to get rid of it or maintain and extend it?
00:39:0479% Of the massachusetts public wants to it continue.
00:39:08I think that's the way this is going to work.
00:39:11People will complain, they'll say, this is not what I want, this is not good.
00:39:13You'll ask, do you want to go back on it?
00:39:18Overwhelmingly, they'll say no.
00:39:20>> You would go farther.
00:39:21I COULDN'T GET senator McConnell to say republicans should campaign on repealing this?
00:39:30>> I think if this bill passes, it's the best thing for the .
00:39:38Party in the short run.
00:39:39The majority of the country is opposed to it.
00:39:41They think their own health care costs will go up.
00:39:42They think the overall cost of the systems will go up.
00:39:48The majority thinks that it will get worse.
00:39:51We could argue in washington, at the capitol.
00:40:02The country is decided.
00:40:03They're overwhelmingly decided on it.
00:40:04Congress wants to pass a bill, whether good many parts, bad in parts, whatever it happens to be, the country doesn't want it.
00:40:10If it passes in january, if they don't sell it, I don't think they will.
00:40:14They're going to go on to jobs quickly.
00:40:20It will be an albatross on almost every democrat in a swing district in the country.
00:40:29>> One of the members of congress speaking against the health care bill is a former freshman democrat from alabama now freshman republican from alabama.
00:40:36Parker griffith.
00:40:37This is what the campaign committee was saying about him last year in a tv ad.
00:40:41>> 2000.
00:40:42The u.s.s. cole is attacked.
00:40:482001, Terrorists attack america.
00:40:512008, The marriott in pakistan is bombed.
00:40:55Parker griffith says we have nothing to fear.
00:41:00>> We have nothing to fear from radical islam.
00:41:05>> Parker griffith, wrong for alabama.
00:41:07>> Now they say right for alabama.
00:41:11Some people say this is a canary in a coal mine.
00:41:16Parker griffith's defection.
00:41:25 daley was quoted -- it may be too late to avoid some losses in 2010, it is not too late to avoid the kind of rout that redraws the political map democrats need to move more to the center.
00:41:34>> I thought he overstated the case.
00:41:36I think parker griffith will be a lonely canary in that coal mine.
00:41:44There's no indication that I can find that any other democrats are thinking about morphing themselves into republicans.
00:41:51To get back to matt's point, the potential albatross of the health care bill, they're going to pivot to jobs, jobs, jobs.
00:42:03Absolutely if they don't start to also, simultaneously, sell this health care bill.
00:42:12If they don't sell it.
00:42:13We're all talking about it like it's a fait accompli.
00:42:25If they don't find way to also sell it as a positive transformation, it will be an albatross.
00:42:28>> How do they do that?
00:42:29>> It's doable and complicated.
00:42:30The complicated part is that many of the things it will achieve will not start until 2013, 2014.
00:42:34It's hard to say to people, life is going to be great two elections from now.
00:42:40If you don't have health care or if you're nervous about your health care.
00:42:47But there's going to be a lot of talk about the immediate deliverables.
00:42:49For example, senior citizens, who are a, nervous about what's happening to medicare.
00:42:57Witness grandma.
00:43:01They'll have their doughnut hole filled or somewhat filled quickly.
00:43:10And people can keep their kids on insurance policies after they're out of college until age 26 or 27.
00:43:16There will be some focus on that.
00:43:17It's hard to talk about legislation that is promising something in the future as people's health premiums continue to go up.
00:43:21>> Can the democrats sell this?
00:43:22>> Some.
00:43:25I'm waiting for the first poll that asks, do you want to repeal this?
00:43:34That's very different from do you approve of it?
00:43:40Let me also say about parker griffith.
00:43:42He's a living fossil.
00:43:42He's the last dixiecrat.
00:43:46Here's the one guy left over.
00:43:49It's not an omen of very much.
00:43:51I don't think health care will be a big sell for the democrats.
00:43:52It's something they have to do.
00:43:55This was a core issue in the campaign.
00:43:57A core promise to the base.
00:44:01Even if part of the base is temporarily, at least, riled up that is is not what they really wanted.
00:44:07It was something they had to check off.
00:44:09It's a little bit like the medicare drug benefit.
00:44:10It was something that bush had to do to just shore up that front.
00:44:15I don't think the campaign will be about health care.
00:44:17I think it's jobs, the economy, and do you want those guys back in?
00:44:24Which is basically -- >> when fdr did the new deal, 70% to 80% of the people had a good view of the government.
00:44:29Now, 15% to 20% have a good view of the government.
00:44:33If you have a whole series of things that look like big government and spending, the peern people are going to take it out on you.
00:44:44A lot of states will get wiped out.
00:44:48Harry reid might get wiped out.
00:44:49>> I was going to say, this is an end of year show.
00:44:50It's a good time for predictions.
00:44:52You offered yours.
00:44:58Charlie cook predicted that republicans will pick up 20 to 30 seats in the house, 4 to 6 in the senate.
00:45:03>> I'm with charlie.
00:45:0820 To 30 at least.
00:45:09Look at states like illinois.
00:45:10A democrat state, a very impressive candidate, you'll see unexpected places.
00:45:19I think assuming things don't change.
00:45:22Republicans will do well.
00:45:24They'll repeal half of health care, the only painful half.
00:45:26>> I think they'll pick up 25 seats in the house and 5 seats in the senate.
00:45:31>> Still not enough to control?
00:45:35>> No.
00:45:36But a prediction in the aftermath.
00:45:39The republicans will misread the mandate.
00:45:44They will think it was because of something shea said or did as opposed to the democrats went off tangent and wasn't in line with the american public.
00:45:48The republicans will do something, that in my view, could be a benefit to barack obama in 2012.
00:45:53If he has to deal with a more republican congress.
00:45:57>> Can I say megadittos for that?
00:46:06>> My prediction is slightly rosier.
00:46:11>> Rosedier for democrats?
00:46:14>> Let's remember the president's party is almost -- almost inevitably loses seats in the midterm election.
00:46:18I think what paul can tell us about the unemployment rate next spring heading into the fall that will determine how people feel about the incumbent party.
00:46:27I say some in the house, SOMEWHERE IN THE 20s, ANYTHING Under 20 will be viewed by democrats as a sigh of relief.
00:46:39In the senate, I think it's a little bit more complicated.
00:46:41There are more republican senators retiring than democrats.
00:46:48And in more divided, swingy-type states.
00:46:54I would say closer to three.
00:46:55>> We're getting close to short on time.
00:46:59I want to ask you a question about the economy for 2010.
00:47:05Your fellow laureate, joseph stiglets says that the u.s.
00:47:07Economy will contract.
00:47:08He's calling on the government to prepare an additional stimulus.
00:47:10Do you agree?
00:47:14>> I think it's possible.
00:47:17We have a recovery not showing up very much in jobs yet.
00:47:22It's been driven by fiscal stimulus that will fade out next year.
00:47:24And by inventory bounce.
00:47:29Production was low, companies were running on their inventories.
00:47:34You get a bounce in the economy.
00:47:36That will run out.
00:47:38The things we know about are all going to be negative in the second half of next year.
00:47:40The financial markets, the last month, they've gotten optimistic.
00:47:44Look at things like, all right, the term spread on bond rates.
00:47:48They suggest that the financial markets think there will be a vigorous recovery.
00:47:51I don't know where it's supposed to come from.
00:47:56The range is huge here.
00:47:57I would go with joe.
00:47:58I'm worried about the second half.
00:47:59>> I have to wrap there.
00:48:04"The roundtable" continues in the green room.
00:48:07Get updates by signing up for our news letter, on
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00:50:38>>> Now, "in memoriam" -- >> I stand before you here tonight at an historic moment for the democratic party and for the american people.
00:50:56>> They're playing our song.
00:50:57>> Oh.
00:51:00♪ Rolling with them ♪
00:51:23>> good evening, everybody.
00:51:24I'm george michael.
00:51:26And welcome to "the sports " >> this week, the pentagon released the names of three soldiers and marines killed in afghanistan.
00:51:52We'll be right back.
00:51:58To pursue the life you want, you need a financial advocate who knows where you want to go.
00:52:05A merrill lynch financial advisor, now with access to the resources of bank of america, can help you diversify, rebalance, imagine, and believe.
00:53:58>>> And now, "the sunday " >> president obama said that he and michelle, his lovely wife are not buying gifts for one another.
00:54:15Way to stimulate the economy.
00:54:16>>> The president said we cannot continue to treat tax money as monopoly money.
00:54:20Oh really?
00:54:21How come all the guys on wall street got get out of jail free cards?
00:54:25>> Over the weekend, the u.s.
00:54:26Transferred 12 detainees to the homelands of afghanistan, yemen, and somalia.
00:54:28We're sending potential terrorists back to their homelands?
00:54:34That's like dropping roman polanski off at a jonas brothers concert.
00:54:42>> Pretty much everyone in our country -- >> I'm sorry, the senator has spoken for ten minutes.
00:54:44>> Could I get an additional moment?
00:54:46>> I object.
00:54:48[ Horn blaring ] blaring ] >> we'll will right back.
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00:56:30Before we go, we bring you the names of the people that work so hard to bring you the show throughout the year.
00:56:36Thanks for watching.
00:56:37Have a happy and safe new year.
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00:58:06It left three people injured.
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